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Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

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knucklebolt

Posts: 206

Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:27 pm

Location: Six miles East of Cheney, Wa.

Post Fri Jun 07, 2013 9:48 am

Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

I aquired a 16" rear wheel and hub that I thought was the old star hub, but looking closely at it the other day I see that it is not. Instead of the five threaded holes for the "star" bearing retainer, there are just two non threaded holes. Other wise it is a drum brake wheel, and my drum fits on it. But I can see the inside of the hub is "different".

I fear it might be an older Sportster wheel? Or is it a newer, drum brake Big Twin wheel? If so, will/would still it work...? What spacers would I use to make it work? Or is it the same wheel with just different bearings? Help!

I'm using a Paughco rigid frame with factory, stock "type" axel plates for early style mechanical brakes.

Thanks.

ken.
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VPH-D

Posts: 43

Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2008 2:24 pm

Post Fri Jun 07, 2013 10:51 am

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

A Sportster rear hub has eight holes thru the hub flange for the drum bolts.
A 67-72 Big Twin hub has a large threaded plug on one side of the hub to retain the bearings, instead of a star cover.
VPH-D
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knucklebolt

Posts: 206

Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:27 pm

Location: Six miles East of Cheney, Wa.

Post Fri Jun 07, 2013 4:00 pm

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

Okay then its a 67 up...is that a direct interchange with the star hub, or will I need different spacers?

Thanks again.

ken.
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RUBONE

Posts: 380

Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2007 7:24 pm

Post Fri Jun 07, 2013 9:45 pm

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

The two small holes are for the collar retainer. They were added about '70 or so.
And NO, it does not interchange with a star hub in any fashion. The only drums that will work with it have bearings in them. The hub itself has one ball bearing on the retainer end, nothing at all on the other end. Rear drums have two bearings, front drums one, and they are specific to that hub.
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knucklebolt

Posts: 206

Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:27 pm

Location: Six miles East of Cheney, Wa.

Post Sat Jun 08, 2013 9:48 am

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

Oh crap, I see what you mean. I'm winding up with a lot of wheels I can't use. Guess I will have to get a new hub and lace it to the wheel, which isn't the worst thing that could happen...then I'll just have a hub I can't use! Thanks for the info.

Thanks.

k.
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45Brit

Posts: 1409

Joined: Tue Nov 27, 2007 2:29 am

Post Sun Jun 09, 2013 1:12 pm

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

I would always prefer to buy the wheel and drum together for that reason
Shoot, a man could have a good weekend in Dallas with all that stuff...
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knucklebolt

Posts: 206

Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:27 pm

Location: Six miles East of Cheney, Wa.

Post Sun Jun 09, 2013 8:31 pm

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

I agree...but I had a drum left over from the knucklehead. !!! Sometimes a shortcut is the long way around. I'm just going to get a hub and lace it to the wheel, which is a nice wheel/good chrome with nice spokes/good chrome, but dirty old painted (at one time) hub. New chrome hub will look nice with it.

Thanks again everyone.

ken.
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RUBONE

Posts: 380

Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2007 7:24 pm

Post Tue Jun 11, 2013 7:05 pm

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

What are you trying to put together? I have a couple of drums made for that hub, but they are hydraulic brake..
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knucklebolt

Posts: 206

Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:27 pm

Location: Six miles East of Cheney, Wa.

Post Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:25 am

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

I'm building a 1937 UL with a Paughco frame, which is set up for the stock mechanical brakes. The frame has the same dimensions as a stock knucklehead/flathead frame, and the axle plates are "original style", or "stock style" plates, kind of plate steel versions of the stock cast plates.

That is something I've been wondering, if the hydraulic drum would work with the mechanical brake backing plate and mechanical brakes, if the right spacer was used or fabricated....although I imagine one could make anything work with enough effort, which could be more trouble and expense than just getting a star hub, which I'm finding they are VERY expensive. !! ??

I've never looked at a schematic of the 67-72 rear axle/brake drum and bearing set up, so I'm not sure how that works. I'll see if I can google one up.

Thanks.

ken
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Frankenstein

User avatar

Posts: 1546

Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2002 12:01 am

Location: Interlaken, NY USA

Post Wed Jun 12, 2013 7:11 pm

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

I'm thinking all things are possible, with enough work1 :lol: I'm curious also if the shoes would physically fit in that drum. I realize that there's probably lots of fabrication and experimentation involved in actually making it work. I too am looking for a cheaper alternative to the star hub, that still looks the part of the older hubs.
DD
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knucklebolt

Posts: 206

Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:27 pm

Location: Six miles East of Cheney, Wa.

Post Wed Jun 12, 2013 8:25 pm

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

Doing a little bit of research and googling it seems that there are plenty of different width drums, shoes, etc., don't think I'll go the fabrication route, even though it does seem like with some tinkering it could work...if one had a lot of the various parts on hand.

Somebody just warn me if the 67-72 and the Star hubs don't take the same spokes. !!! Otherwise it seems a simple, if not inexpensive, fix to lace a star hub to my wheel. As mentioned, my wheel and spokes are in nice shape, so with a new hub it will look nice if nothing else. !

k.
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Frankenstein

User avatar

Posts: 1546

Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2002 12:01 am

Location: Interlaken, NY USA

Post Thu Jun 13, 2013 2:06 am

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

they do take the same spokes. The pattern changes if you use a late HD rim vs an older Kelsey hayes, but same spokes.
DD
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knucklebolt

Posts: 206

Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:27 pm

Location: Six miles East of Cheney, Wa.

Post Thu Jun 13, 2013 10:08 am

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

That's what I thouhgt, but I sure have been having bad luck when it comes to buying wheels. Then there was the frame-fiasco, (but the frame I got from Paughco ROCKS!!!!) but, everything else has come together good.

k.
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RUBONE

Posts: 380

Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2007 7:24 pm

Post Thu Jun 13, 2013 8:44 pm

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

Basically it comes down to a simple lesson..
Do your homework FIRST, buy later...
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knucklebolt

Posts: 206

Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:27 pm

Location: Six miles East of Cheney, Wa.

Post Wed Jun 19, 2013 9:15 pm

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

Trouble is, I used to know this stuff, but 25 years later I've forgotten more than I knew. :)

k.
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jerseymutt

Posts: 4

Joined: Sun Aug 06, 2006 5:14 am

Location: Exit 91, Brick, NJ

Post Tue Jul 02, 2013 12:37 pm

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

I hear you on the forgetting more then you know and I'm kinda in the same boat. Use it or lose it. I have been poking around as I am doing a 47 flathead build in a Santee frame (wish I had an original) and after some reading and some measuring I find most aftermarket frames are alteast a 1/4 wider then the stock frames even if the say stock dimensions. On my frame the stock wheel (mechanical brake) sits about a 1/2 to the left of center and I have to get the wheel offset to compensate. I thought I might mention this here so you don't get all done with the wheel and have to go back and offset it. Anyone else run into this?

Mutt
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Frankenstein

User avatar

Posts: 1546

Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2002 12:01 am

Location: Interlaken, NY USA

Post Thu Jul 04, 2013 7:25 am

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

I built a PanShovel Bobber last winter, used a Kraft Tech frame from Midusa. Things fit pretty well, used the mid style hub and brake drum/backing plate. The axle right side spacer fit fine, had to engineer left side spacers, I didn't have originals so just went to town on the lathe. I'm thinking that because the axle worked o.k, the spacing between plates couldn't have been too far off. It did use 1 1/4" frame tubes, but unless parked next to a stocker, you don't notice the difference.
DD
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knucklebolt

Posts: 206

Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:27 pm

Location: Six miles East of Cheney, Wa.

Post Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:32 pm

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

Good points...I'm using a Paughco frame which "should" be close/right, and has the stock style axle plates, but putting the rear wheel together from parts, after market axle kit, etc., I expect some work getting it lined up right. Right now I've got the brake backing plate, and drum/sprocket lined up, and sprockets lined up, but there does seem to be an issue with the right side spacer...but again, I expect some of that. Otherwise, looks like the brake side of the hub, brake drum, backing plate all line up when I mock it up in the frame with just the hub, backing plate, drum, and axle and assorted axle parts, and throwing some washers in on the deal between the right side spacer and frame.

The axle from the kit is the right length, perfect fit for the frame, so I believe my frame is also of the correct width, but that the right side spacer is a bit short for some reason.

I just laced a new J&P Star hub up to my wheel, (last night) but it hasn't been trued yet, I'll take your advice and mock it up an see what/how much offset I want, just in case the stock offset isn't right for it.

By the way, what do you mean that the pattern changes between the late HD rim and the KH?

k.
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Limey_Dave

Posts: 202

Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2006 3:08 pm

Location: Middle England UK

Post Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:41 pm

Re: Advice time again, Big Twin rear wheel/hub

Double check that the spoke heads are seated in the hub correctly,I think the star hub rims were dimpled at a different angle to the later rims.

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