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45 K Model

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celticdodge

Posts: 139

Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2006 5:29 am

Location: USA

Post Thu Aug 06, 2009 2:31 pm

45 K Model

I haven't been on the site in a while after seeing the John deer tractor 45 I though I would submit some pictures for inspiration and comments. I've been thinking about putting floor bored's on. My inspiration for this bike goes to Eric's "Beauty of Speed" website most notably is 2003 and 2004 WR racer which I must say became my obsession, I couldn't help looking at those bikes almost everyday. I just couldn't make it through the day without looking at those bikes, they were just amazing. The construction and concept of this bike is a tribute in the purest sense, not only to Eric but to all the members of this site and their invaluable contributions in sharing their knowledge. I also have to say that a "Victory" website and the books and tech papers buy Jeffery Diamond are the best of their kind I have come upon and certainly recommend them to anyone. Thanks to everyone.
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Beachdog

Posts: 765

Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 12:01 am

Location: CA USA

Post Thu Aug 06, 2009 4:13 pm

Re: 45 K Model

Awesome!
My old eyes can't figure out where your ignition spark is coming from. How is the ignition set up?
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celticdodge

Posts: 139

Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2006 5:29 am

Location: USA

Post Thu Aug 06, 2009 7:39 pm

Re: 45 K Model

Thanks for the kind words Beachdog ,still working on it,I plan to run a magneto and then one of those new fangled mini alternators to be able to provide power to the lights and maybe a nitrious solinoid if it becomes streetable.
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George Greer

User avatar

Posts: 961

Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2002 12:01 am

Location: Markt Einersheim, Germany

Post Thu Aug 06, 2009 8:41 pm

Re: 45 K Model

Thats hot!!

George
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Pa

Site Admin

Posts: 4677

Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2000 1:01 am

Location: Ohio USA

Post Thu Aug 06, 2009 9:20 pm

Re: 45 K Model

Real nice machine for sure. Are ya gonna allow the Purty Little Woman to ride it also ? Looks to me like she says... yeah he is ! :wink: ..
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37ULH

Posts: 682

Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2002 1:01 am

Location: somerset, oh usa

Post Thu Aug 06, 2009 10:23 pm

Re: 45 K Model

Gorgeous bike! Hope it ends up going as good as it looks.
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45Brit

Posts: 1412

Joined: Tue Nov 27, 2007 2:29 am

Post Fri Aug 07, 2009 1:23 am

Re: 45 K Model

I'd be most interested to know how nitrous works in side-valve engines?
Shoot, a man could have a good weekend in Dallas with all that stuff...
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panic

Post Fri Aug 07, 2009 7:22 am

Re: 45 K Model

Very pretty!
I've found that although the "bikini" fairing is not as effective as a full-size, it's a big improvement at high speed. Doesn't do much around town, but once you get to 60 or so, the wind doesn't get any worse.
The front pipe is not only art. but (as the factory discovered) having a large exit radius is also best for both flow and cylinder temperature.
I wish there were an easy way to re-position the front caliper. Everything looks correct, but the extra weight is ahead of the stem axis and adds to the amount of force needed to move the steering. Kawasaki discovered this (and other may have long before) in the early 1970s, and put the dual disc calipers behind the fork, and right under the stem axis so the gyroscopic pendulum weight effect is much less. However, this requires a link in compression.
This may be possible if the link were a parallelogram (like a 4 link) in the horizontal plane to prevent "kinking" on load, but very complex to design and build and I don't know what would happen to anti-dive etc.
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45Brit

Posts: 1412

Joined: Tue Nov 27, 2007 2:29 am

Post Sat Aug 08, 2009 2:27 am

Re: 45 K Model

is that a BMW fairing? looks like the sort of thing fitted to 70s Beemers, apart from the side-skirts.

The BMW fairings were notorious for causing handlebar wobble if not correctly adjusted, personally I would suspect that would be an issue here, especially with the side-skirts which were never usual over here for that very reason. Side-skirts also greatly increase side area and hence, windage. Frame-mounted fairings distribute the forces directly to the centre of gravity. The mountings aren't clear but it gives the impression of being fork-mounted - is this correct?
Shoot, a man could have a good weekend in Dallas with all that stuff...
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RUBONE

Posts: 380

Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2007 7:24 pm

Post Sat Aug 08, 2009 10:08 am

Re: 45 K Model

Faring looks like a universal EMGO to me. Easily available (And inexpensive!) and mounts to about anything. Similar in shape to the BMW "S" fairing but actually quite different. The 45/K is very cool. Nice job on it! Hope it goes as good as it looks.
Robbie
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john HD

User avatar

Posts: 302

Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2006 5:26 pm

Location: madison wisconsin usa

Post Sat Aug 08, 2009 10:59 am

Re: 45 K Model

very nice!

makes me wish for my long gone XLCR

enjoy it!

john
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Chris Haynes

Posts: 2625

Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2000 12:01 am

Location: Los Angeles, CA

Post Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:10 am

Re: 45 K Model

RUBONE wrote:Faring looks like a universal EMGO to me. Easily available (And inexpensive!) and mounts to about anything. Similar in shape to the BMW "S" fairing but actually quite different. The 45/K is very cool. Nice job on it! Hope it goes as good as it looks.
Robbie


Hey Robbie,
Have you ever wondered where EMGO products got their name? The company owner is EMilio GOmez. :mrgreen:
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45Brit

Posts: 1412

Joined: Tue Nov 27, 2007 2:29 am

Post Sat Aug 08, 2009 2:52 pm

Re: 45 K Model

I like the overall bike a lot, love the narrow tanks and the engineering around the engine and transmission.. but the fairing? Sorry, doesn't do it for me at all
Shoot, a man could have a good weekend in Dallas with all that stuff...
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celticdodge

Posts: 139

Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2006 5:29 am

Location: USA

Post Sat Aug 08, 2009 6:03 pm

Re: 45 K Model

Thanks for the kind comments guys,next time I might try a girder front similar to a Durfee or Indian with disc mounted behind the rear girder leg as Panic suggested .I hadn't seen a fairing on a springer before so I thought I would experiment with the universal fairing,thought it might actually help if I used nitrious in an attempt to get some high speed.I will post a picture of the fairing support later.The motor has a 4 5/8 stroke,tall cylinders,will have Khk cams, CV carb,big Manley valves,ported,piston oilers, hand made this and that,you guys know how it is ,halfway through and planning the next one.I'll let you all know if goes or blows.Again thanks for looking,and believe it or not ,in a way you all helped build this bike with your invaluable expertise that you often share with everyone here on this board.Thanks again. :D :D
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Eric @ B.O.S

Posts: 950

Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2000 1:01 am

Location: Paris ::: France

Post Sun Aug 09, 2009 7:22 am

Re: 45 K Model

Really cool bike. I love all the details. Not sure about the faring though. Race bikes are never finished so I'm sure it will evolve some more. Let us know how it runs.

Thanks for the compliments on the inspiration etc... I feel honored. The whole idea with the Beauty of Speed website was to share my enthusiasm for these 45 racers so I'm glad if it can help anyone.
Eric
Eric @ B.O.S
www.beautyofspeed.com
A state of the art power quest
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panic

Post Sun Aug 09, 2009 7:51 am

Re: 45 K Model

big Manley valves

Details?
I contacted them, long ago (after seeing the usual claim "we can make any valve you need"), and of course, they responded "don't be silly, why would anyone want a valve like that".

What dimensions did you give them?
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celticdodge

Posts: 139

Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2006 5:29 am

Location: USA

Post Sun Aug 09, 2009 5:02 pm

Re: 45 K Model

In reference to the Manley valves I called and talked to them and they were really very helpful.I sent them a valve to use as a copy along with a drawing and had both intakes and exhaust made 5.875 in length to fit the tall K model cylinders.The valves are stainless with a swirl polish(Ithink they were Gen 2),the standard stem diameter Manley used was slightly larger than the standard Harley and I reamed each valve guide to obtain the minimum clearance .The face diameter of the intakes were 1.875 and I can't remember the size of the exhaust right now but I think the face diameter was the same as a stock K Model.I ran into a slight problem with a long exhaust valve on the front cylinder in that I had to grind the top of the tappet adjuster down a few thousandths to get the clearance needed to adjust the valves.In retrospect I think you could get buy with the shorter valves and just extend the adjuster screws out a little farther,in fact it may be that using the shorter valves may be the way to go in that they may weigh less than the longer and I would assume subsequently heavier longer valves.On the next motor I would try to look at using a smaller valve stem diameter .I have will probably machine up some aluminum collars.I also modified my intake manifold,I didn't have a K model manifold so I essentially made one to fit and I am using Peek seals and the tappet guides and Wr valve spring covers are from Enfield Racing(Serious racing components).The piston to head clearance was machined per each individual head to .035 . Manleys turn around on the valves was about 3 weeks and they were about half the price of normal retail.Hope this helps. Hope this helps ,Thanks for looking. :D
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Neil74

Posts: 251

Joined: Sat May 20, 2006 9:38 pm

Location: Hudson, Florida

Post Sun Aug 09, 2009 7:19 pm

Re: 45 K Model

Absolutely Stunning..... Very nice job on the bike too:) Very nice attention to detail.
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greg1

Posts: 336

Joined: Thu Dec 05, 2002 1:01 am

Location: Kirksville Missouri United States

Post Mon Aug 10, 2009 3:14 am

Re: 45 K Model

All i can say is i'm in the middle of building a twin to your bike and didn't even know about your build.I have a wish list for my solo project and one off the biggest things for me is it MUST be black,frame,springer,handlebars,fender,etc.
I too have khk cylinders,i found a stock bore set,and KH heads,i'm running KH cams as a friend of a friend sold me a choice matching set from the same bike for $150.00.I figure i'll just change to Bruce's KHK cam lobes if the KH cams don't satisfy me.I'll be running a set of 4 5/8" wheels and sportster rods.I'm even using shouldered aluminum wheels like you're running.I plan to stick with drum brakes,mostly for the vintage look.
This isn't just a pipe dream i'm having, i already have a 1941-46 solo frame,stock springer front end,aluminum 18" sportster shouldered wheel assemblies,KHK cylinders,KH heads and cams,a mint set of 1951 W cases with cam cover,and a few brake items,etc.I won't be able to get her done by this riding season but i'm putting every bit of my energy and funds in having it done next summer,or fall at the latest.I also plan on running Bruce's tappet guides,i've corresponded with him several times and he's very helpful.Who's lifters and what brand did you decide to run?I'm curious to the valve springs you run as well.It'll be good info as i want to start out with springs that won't bind at KHK cam lift.I had planned on running those cams but $750.00 was the cheapest used set i found .I have the matched set of KH cams now in mint shape for the $150.00,so even after spending $500 on new KHK lobes from Bruce i'll have a basically new set of cams for $650.00.
Well sorry to rattle but now you've motivated me to spend a couple hours on the bike today.
And as to the eye candy you look to be very fortunate in the lady department as well,no disrespect intended......
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celticdodge

Posts: 139

Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2006 5:29 am

Location: USA

Post Mon Aug 10, 2009 4:46 am

Re: 45 K Model

Greg1,I am using K Model lifters or tappets which have a thinner wall and 3 small lightening holes as opposed to the heavy thick walled 2 holed 45 roller tappet.There was a good discussion in the archives of this forum regarding tappet weight,It would be worth your time to check it out,If anyone here knows of a lighter tappet I would like to know.While I think about it, I find it strange that as important as is to lighten the reciprocating wight of the valve train components that the flat shoe type tappets used in the factory WR racers are not drilled with lightening holes.My springs are currently stock although I have my machined spacers to work with the taller cylinders and the KHK cams I plan to get from Bruce at Enfield Racing.The ''Babe'' is one of my young daughters who is blushingly surprised at the nice comments.Hope I answered all your questions,maybe some will jump in here and help us out with some information about light tappets. :D :D
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