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WLA Trans In Progress

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FlatHeadSix

Posts: 49

Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 9:45 am

Post Wed Apr 01, 2009 8:19 pm

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

Pa
A trick you can use to restore those WWII gaskets and keep them supple enough to work with for the duration of the build, and beyond, is to pour a little glycerin in the pan of water when you soak them . You can buy a small bottle of pure glycerin at most old fashioned drug stores, if you can't find any, then CornHusker's Hand Lotion is the next best thing. I have even been able to salvage the old surplus genuine cork fuel and oil cap gaskets using that trick, but you need a BUNCH of glycerine for them. Be patient, give them time to soak up the moisture and they actually become very useable again.

mike
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George Greer

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Post Wed Apr 01, 2009 8:45 pm

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

Pa,

Don't you have to install the bracket for the rear chain oiler pipe on the return spring stud?

George
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Jackie

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Location: Germany

Post Thu Apr 02, 2009 11:04 am

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

Thanks very much for your quick response but actually I meant the RADIAL clearance between shifting fork shaft and side cover.
It must be my basic english posting.php?mode=reply&f=6&t=10548&sid=63acc03b54e6c1c0ce9cc2e980151eca#
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Pa

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Location: Ohio USA

Post Thu Apr 02, 2009 2:15 pm

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

FlatHeadSix wrote:Pa
A trick you can use to restore those WWII gaskets and keep them supple enough to work with for the duration of the build, and beyond, is to pour a little glycerin in the pan of water when you soak them . You can buy a small bottle of pure glycerin at most old fashioned drug stores, if you can't find any, then CornHusker's Hand Lotion is the next best thing. I have even been able to salvage the old surplus genuine cork fuel and oil cap gaskets using that trick, but you need a BUNCH of glycerine for them. Be patient, give them time to soak up the moisture and they actually become very useable again.

mike


Thanks Mike ! I never thought of that. And to think... I have glycerin here to boot ! :D
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Pa

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Post Thu Apr 02, 2009 2:21 pm

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

George Greer wrote:Pa,

Don't you have to install the bracket for the rear chain oiler pipe on the return spring stud?

George


I don't know George. Does it attach there ? Pa
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Pa

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Post Thu Apr 02, 2009 2:22 pm

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

Jackie wrote:Thanks very much for your quick response but actually I meant the RADIAL clearance between shifting fork shaft and side cover.
It must be my basic english posting.php?mode=reply&f=6&t=10548&sid=63acc03b54e6c1c0ce9cc2e980151eca#


Yes Jackie...That is what I thought you were talking about. Pa
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Pa

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Post Thu Apr 02, 2009 2:26 pm

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

Make certain transmission is in the neutral position ! Rolling the gear shifter drum while simultaneously rotating either the drive sprocket gear, or the clutch gear, will allow you to go through the gear ranges, until you locate the neutral position. KEEP AN EYE ON THE SHIFTER FORK SHAFT while doing this !! Check it often ! You will know you have found the neutral position when both the gear shifter cam plunger ball drops into the neutral pocket on the edge of the gear shifter cams body exterior, and the clutch gear remains motionless, while rotating the drive sprocket gear. When rotating the clutch gear in the neutral position, the drive sprocket gear will remain motionless also. Referencing the previous photograph above, we will make certain to keep the backlash out of the gear shifter cam, in the direction of the drive sprocket gear. Note....The back lash procedure will allow us to know the widest point of clearance we have. If the specific clearance tolerance, for correct fitment, is ...say... .052" to .058", the .058" would be our maximum clearance number value, with all back lash taken out. Since .003" to .005" is our final gear shifter cam end play tolerance, and.... we know what shim we will need in the opposite end of the gear shifter cam [ if one should be needed ], in order to obtain these tolerances, we also know, how much the gear shifter cam will travel, in the other direction, upon final assembly. In other words, if we hit the maximum wide tolerance of .058", with the gear shifter cam and the shifter clutches, back lashes taken out, we can subtract our obtained clearance from this value, and then know our minimum clearance obtained. If our gear shifter cam shaft end play clearance will be .003", we subtract this value from our .058" value and we now have a minimum clearance value of .055", on the particular gear shifter clutch we were adjusting. Our minimum and maximum values now fall within tolerance specifications. Although, we managed to obtain clearance values within acceptable levels, It would be best if we can nail our tolerances, dead nuts on, “in the middle of the acceptable tolerance range“. WHY ???? We have other components which will wear as the transmission is in operation. Each shifter fork will wear thinner on both sides, creating more clearance. The gear shifter paths, which are cut into the gear shifter drum, will wear wider, creating more clearance as well. Shifter clutch fork grooves will wear wider. Gear faces will wear. etc... Our goal is to obtain the best clearance values now, so the transmission will provide us with more life. We can miss the mid range values and the transmission will still function very well. We will sacrifice life expectancy though. OK....Now more lecturing. LOL !

We will now proceed to measure our present, low and 2nd &high shifter clutch clearances. Referencing the next two photographs below, we will check our present low and 2nd & high shifter clutch clearances. The first image below shows the use of a small hole gauge, which is fitted between the face of the low gears teeth and the low gear shifter forks face. I like using a small hole gauge for the low gear shifter fork clearance measurement. The tool is a precise expandable and collapsing measuring device, which works perfectly for this particular gear shifter clutch. An outside mic is used to measure the small hole gauge, once feel has been set, after gauging with it. Stacked feeler gauge leaves will work also, but they are difficult to keep stacked while taking measurements. They are also difficult to feel with when stacked. Fractional, letter, and number drill bits [ the shank ends ], work well also. These can be used as go and no go gauges and feel is good with them. Note....mic the drill bits for actual diameter. They are not always what they say they are. Once you have obtained a present clearance value on the low shifter clutch, you now know where this clearance stands, in reference to the tolerance range of factory specifications. As you may recall, when we assembled both shifter fork assemblies, we had assembled, one each, 2253-33B -.007” and 2253-33A - .014” shims, to each of them. Our present, initial, clearance value taken, on the low gear shifter clutch, will now determine, whether we add or subtract from these shims. This same mathematical formula, will be use on the clearance value found, when we take our initial 2nd & high shifter clutch clearance measurement. Moving over to the 2nd & high shifter clutch.... The only real difference between measuring the 2nd & high and low shifter clutches, is where the 2nd & high shifter clutch measurement is taken. The method of taking the measurement is pretty much the same. Measurement is taken between the protruding drive dog faces on the 2nd & high shifter clutch and the protruding drive dog faces on the 2513-41 clutch gear. Rotate clutch gear so protruding drive dogs line up with protruding drive dogs on 2nd & high shifter clutch. Initially I use stacked feeler gauge leaves on my first measurement. Though not as accurate for measurement taking, the stack feeler gauge leaves provide me with a reference point. This reference point allows me to choose selected sized fractional, letter, and number sized drill bits, for a more accurate measurement. I would use a smaller precision small hole gauge here, but my set does not go down that small. I have to improvise instead. You can also use wire gauges or a combination of one drill bit size and one feeler gauge leaf. OK...Back to the 2nd & high shifter clutch clearance measurement....Once you have obtained an accurate measurement, you now know whether you will add or subtract shims, on this shifter fork assembly as well. Once accurate measurements are taken, and it has been determined whether you will remove or add shims, to the two shifter fork assemblies, you get to disassemble the gear shifter cam and the gear shifter fork assemblies once again. LOL !! With accurate measurements, correct mathematics, a bit of luck, the next assembly of these components will be you last assembly of them. After correcting the shims on both shifter clutches, reinstall all components and re take both shifter clutch clearance measurements. If within tolerances, partially remove the gear shifter cam shaft from the gear shifter cam, only enough to allow you to install the gear shifter cam endplay shim, if one would be needed, in front of the gear shifter cams gear face, and aligned with the bore of the gear shifter cam. Install the 2245-36A oil seal onto the gear shifter cam shaft [ fits in groove on gear shifter cam shaft ] [ sprocket side of transmission ] and re insert the gear shifter cam shaft into the gearbox bore. Lock gear shifter cam into place with the 2244-38A screw. The screw threads into the hole on top of the clutch gear side of the transmission case. Tip of screw locates in groove of gear shifter cam shaft......... If not within tolerances yet........Start the whole shifter clutch adjusting procedure all over again...LOL !

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Pa

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Post Thu Apr 02, 2009 3:31 pm

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

George....In regards to the mounting of the rear chain oiler, I just looked through Bruce Palmers big book and he states, something to the effect, the chain oiler is mounted to various parts of the engine on all Side valve models, depending on model. Are you certain of the starter spring stud mounting ??? Or could you be refering to the chain guard forward mounting stud, which is mounted in a tapped hole, in the top rear area of the sprocket cover ? Pa
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Pa

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Post Thu Apr 02, 2009 4:05 pm

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

Time to install the 2084-41 starter crank spring.....The first three photographs below, show the procedure I use for installing the spring. In the first image, I have initially slipped the spring onto the countershaft, only enough to where the outer surface of the springs windings are flush with the face of the countershaft. Note how I positioned the springs hook [ open end facing front of transmission ] and 90 degrees from the starter crank spring stud. It is also position 180 degrees from the radius notched area of the countershaft. This positioning of the starter crank spring is so we can preload tension to the starter crank spring, once we seat the hooked end of the spring onto the starter crank spring stud. The second photograph shows the starter crank spring installed further onto the countershaft. This time though, we installed it far enough onto the countershaft so that the starter crank spring, will catch the starter crank stud, just enough to hold the hooked end of the starter crank spring onto the starter crank stud. I use a blunt nosed flat blade screw driver to force the hooked end of the starter crank spring. I insert the tip of the screw driver, vertically beneath the pocket of the hooked spring end and force the hook, in a clockwise motion, up and inline, with the starter crank spring stud. Once there, I guide the beginning of the hooked end onto the starter crank spring stud. Making certain hooked end is on the stud, to a safe enough point, where it won't jump back off of the stud, I begin installing the starter crank spring the rest on the way onto the countershaft, third image below. I use the blunt nosed screw driver as a driver to do this. By placing the screw driver flat blade on the outer surface of the spring, and flush against the flats of the countershaft, I tap around all four sides of the countershaft, until I drive the spring the rest of the way onto the countershaft. While tapping the spring along the countershaft, I also tap the hooked end of the spring further onto the starter crank spring. The starter crank spring is slightly recessed on its diameter for the hooked end of the spring to seat into. The hooked end may not fall right into place, over the stud A downward tap on the backside radius of the hooked end, will accomplish this. Note.....The starter crank spring coil, must be far enough onto the countershaft, in order to prevent the spring from rubbing on the sprocket cover, when the spring is contacting and expanding during kicking over, once the sprocket cover has been installed.

Image
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Pa

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Post Thu Apr 02, 2009 5:06 pm

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

Installing the 2260-41 Sprocket cover......... BEND A TAB ON THE DRIVE SPROCKET LOCK WASHER !!! Then....Just basic here. Align the gearbox studs to all of the sprocket cover stud holes and gently tap the sprocket cover onto the studs evenly, until sprocket cover is seated against the side cover. Installed the 0259 lock washers and the 0117 nuts onto the studs. The 0117 nuts have a washer type looking face on them. This face goes onto the studs first. Tighten down the nuts evenly, using a staggered pattern, until they compress the 0259 lock washers. Then torque them down good. Sorry ....no torque specs here either. Note......how the pin in the face of the sprocket cover will retain the gear shifter fork shaft. Photo below.

Image
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Pa

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Post Thu Apr 02, 2009 6:06 pm

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

Preparing to install the 2446-41clutch push rod assembly.........................This unit [ next photograph below ] slips through the sprocket cover, from the sprocket cover side, and into the hole through the core of the mainshaft. One of the biggest problems with this unit is the lack of lubrication in them. It doesn’t matter whether they are used OEM or NOS OEM. They are usually dry of lubrication. I came up with the following method of lubricating them, shown in the next photograph below. Yep.....That is what you see ! A syringe !! I got dozens of these, which are left over, unused ones, from when I damn near died, from a severe staff infection. Since I had to pay dearly for them, I kept them around. Then one day I needed to lube a very small area of a component on an automobile. I came up with using these. It is a pain to load the grease into it but it will direct the flow of grease into even the tiniest places. In the face of an OEM clutch pushrod assembly is a pocket, where you can barely see the ball bearings beneath the tin covering and pressure point fulcrum. I inject the grease into this opening, while rotating the pushrod end of the assembly, until no more grease will enter the fulcrum body of the assembly. Works Great !!!

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Pa

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Post Fri Apr 03, 2009 6:04 am

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

Another Intermission............... I have verified what George siad about the chain oiler mounting. It does go onto the stater crank spring stud. Not a problem though. The sprocket cover, crank arm, and starter crank spring is not difficult to remove and reinstall. I will mount the oiler line after the transmission is permanently mounted into the bike frame. I would think, the mounting of the line would be much easier then. In the meantime, I'll continue the build until completed. Thanks George ! You saved me some points !! :D Pa
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Pa

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Post Fri Apr 03, 2009 8:29 pm

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

Next episode should come shortly. I want to have the clutch gear seal parts ready for installation, before I go on. The NOS rubber seals are a bit on the hard side. I am soaking them in automatic transmission sealer to soften them up. This is an old rubber refurbishing trick, to revitalize old rubber. Pa
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100incscoot

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Location: atascadero cal usa

Post Fri Apr 03, 2009 9:31 pm

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

yep heres a factory pic to prove georges statement about the oiler line
Image
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Pa

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Post Fri Apr 03, 2009 9:46 pm

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

Thanks Bro ! I really want to get this dead on ! That is two verifications to prove the mounting of the chain oiler. Bruce don't miss much. There is very little that bruce has not seen, done, or experienced. In this case, he must have, without thinking, left it out of his big book. I'll tease him good on this one ! :mrgreen: As I said though, I will finish the build and mount the chain oiler after installing the trans into the frame. Seems like the logical way to go. Heh ? :) Pa
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RUBONE

Posts: 380

Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2007 7:24 pm

Post Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:48 pm

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

Pa,
Don't forget that the chain oiler was not stock on most 45s. It was on '42 WLAs, WLCs, and on Servi-cars but was optional on all others. Rarely found on a standard 45, so don't sweat it too much! :wink:
Robbie
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FlatHeadSix

Posts: 49

Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 9:45 am

Post Sat Apr 04, 2009 6:19 am

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

Pa wrote:I really want to get this dead on ! :) Pa


Pa, make sure you get the angle correct when you slash cut the drag pipe like the one in Scoot's factory photo. Loud & Proud! :twisted:

mike
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Kev UK

Posts: 168

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Location: Carmarthen, Wales, UK

Post Sat Apr 04, 2009 6:32 am

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

FlatHeadSix wrote:
Pa wrote:I really want to get this dead on ! :) Pa


Pa, make sure you get the angle correct when you slash cut the drag pipe like the one in Scoot's factory photo. Loud & Proud! :twisted:

mike


:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
72 Ironhead, goes better than it stops!

42(?)WLC

2005 XL1200R.... well ya gotta have a rat-bike!
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100incscoot

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Location: atascadero cal usa

Post Sat Apr 04, 2009 10:03 am

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

now i know your not disputing thats a factory pic are you? :roll:
pa if you building a wla it most certainly will need the oiler to be correct
check out that cool ass chain guard
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Pa

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Post Sat Apr 04, 2009 10:41 am

Re: WLA Trans In Progress

Pa, make sure you get the angle correct when you slash cut the drag pipe like the one in Scoot's factory photo. Loud & Proud! :twisted:

mike[/quote]

:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
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