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My first Flathead rebuild (1966 servi-car)

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Bikefiend Chuck

Posts: 2

Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2006 9:11 am

Post Fri Jun 16, 2006 3:32 pm

My first Flathead rebuild (1966 servi-car)

I've got a parts book,shop manual.I've rebuilt Triumph engines.Just wondering if i should be aware of anything particular other than usual,mike the cylinders,crank,etc. for service -wear limits.I guess i'm askin what to look for that might give me problems disassembling this 45 engine.The engine was froze when i got it.I un-torqued the heads and used penetrating oil and freed the engine and thats where i'm at. Oh yea,i built a stand for it.I was thinking just a stock rebuild, but heer again any advice would be appreciated.I see parts everwhere on the web for these things. Thanks in advance for any info. and for your time......Chuck
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47knuck

Posts: 527

Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2005 1:01 am

Location: Ogden, Utah, USA

Post Fri Jun 16, 2006 7:17 pm

Chuck: Have some fun with it and ask for help when you need it. Some freindly folks on here.
Steve H
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Chris Haynes

Posts: 2603

Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2000 12:01 am

Location: Los Angeles, CA

Post Fri Jun 16, 2006 10:30 pm

Your Triumph had a one piece crankshaft with rods with removable caps. Your Servicar has five piece flywheel assenbly with male and female rods with roller bearings. It is a totally different beast.
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100incscoot

Posts: 2399

Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 1:01 am

Location: atascadero cal usa

Post Fri Jun 16, 2006 10:38 pm

dont be scared of it its just a extra large lawn mower motor and just pay very close attention to the manual step by step
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Pa

Site Admin

Posts: 4478

Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2000 1:01 am

Location: Ohio USA

Post Thu Jun 22, 2006 7:36 am

It also came stock with the better electric starter system. Parts for those are available here.. http://www.vtwinrebuild.com Pa
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Panhead Mike

Posts: 9

Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2005 6:21 pm

Location: East Bay, California

Post Fri Jun 23, 2006 1:06 am

Take your time...ask questions.

Just finished the top end on my 46G...cylinders, pistons, valves etc. Had to drill out the heads for larger bolts (didn't see that one coming).

Getting ready to start on my brothers 64G and I have to agree with PA that trani is a real piece of cr*p. Gonna have to tell my Bro that he needs to sell that one to some one that must have the 64/65 box and by something that works.

Kicking works for my and mine starts on the first one every time.

Mike.
"Will Ride for Food"
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Pa

Site Admin

Posts: 4478

Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2000 1:01 am

Location: Ohio USA

Post Tue Jun 27, 2006 5:28 am

Good point clarifying that Billy. It is the top that sucks, not the bottom. Basically all 41-73 bottoms are the same. 64-73 left out some of the kick starter goodies. All of these bottoms can be made e starts. Pa
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Panhead Mike

Posts: 9

Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2005 6:21 pm

Location: East Bay, California

Post Tue Jun 27, 2006 11:16 am

Thanks to both Sleeper & PA for helping me to understand a little bit more...
So let me get this right...the reason the 64 box keeps blowing its lid is because of the screw sizes and not for some lock up reason as I have read?
That would mean that I could just get a new case (64-73) and re-use the lid, starter and all the guts. The inside of the case is broken off everywhere there are screw/bolt (re-drilled larger) holes. May try having holes welded up and then drill/tap new ones but not real confident that it would last.

Sorry Chuck for getting off target.
I'll step out now and post rear wheel hub puller question somewhere else.

MMK2000
Mike.
"Will Ride for Food"
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Pa

Site Admin

Posts: 4478

Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2000 1:01 am

Location: Ohio USA

Post Tue Jun 27, 2006 9:26 pm

No.............the reason your tranny keeps blowing lids is because of the design of the top e start system and other related components on the bike. The screw thread change was made as a fix by the factory that didn't really work in order to prevent that problem with the top blowing off. Although the new thread was a stronger thread it could not hold the top on when it decided to come up and off. What caused this action of the top blowing off to occurr ??? Believe it or not.....it was the engine tuning !! Timing was the biggest caulprid at the heart of the problem. The early auto advance timers did not operate efficient and accurately enough to time the engine properly at all start up times. Kick back would occur when the timers failed to run as designed and it was that kick back that tossed the top of the tranny off. The force of the kicking back engine had no where to go but back to the tranny top via the starter bendix gear. Something had to give. That something was the tranny top screws or tranny top screw bosses. Usually an ear or two were broken off on the tranny top. The 1964-65 tranny e start was not the end of this problem though. The 1966-73 e start system suffered the same fate at times but it wasn't always for the same reason. Though the 66-73 system was the most reliable system offered and although it failed very rarely, unlike the early e start system which would stick the bendix gear in or out, sometimes stripping the bendix gear clear off or, at times, burning up the starter motor, there was a simuliar reason for failures that both systems shared at times, other than the duly noted differences between the two systems. I mentioned timing in the beginning. The later auto advance timer was a vast improvement over the early auto advance unit and it helped remove many of these tranny top blow offs. But ???? Not all of them ! The most common cause of failure in both systems was poorly tuned and timed engines. As I mentioned, the later auto advance timer was a big help in preventing tranny top blow off but if an owner didn't keep his engine in good tuned running condition, tranny top blow off was the end result on both early and later e start systems. The main difference between the early and later sytem is reliability only. Tranny top blow offs were the owners fault in most cases. Only the earlier auto advance timer could be blamed for tranny top blow off on a well maintained machine. Pa
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Panhead Mike

Posts: 9

Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2005 6:21 pm

Location: East Bay, California

Post Wed Jun 28, 2006 12:05 am

Wow...I am blown away!
That is the most logical explaination I have heard. I haven't spent too much time thinking about the 64 yet but now I know what direction to go in.
Hope you don't mind but I copied your explaination to my computer since I tend to forget the things I need to remember most.
This bike is one my dad picked up years ago and is has an 18 over(at least) springer with wide mag wheels in the back. Definately would say it was rode hard in the 70's and probably not well maintained. Pulled the heads..the front one is cracked and the pistons and valves are burnt bad.
Thanks for the good info.
Mike.
"Will Ride for Food"
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Pa

Site Admin

Posts: 4478

Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2000 1:01 am

Location: Ohio USA

Post Wed Jun 28, 2006 5:25 am

Glad I could help. Pa
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Pa

Site Admin

Posts: 4478

Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2000 1:01 am

Location: Ohio USA

Post Thu Jun 29, 2006 5:36 am

Good point Billy. :wink: Sorry I left that out. Darn Pa-Simers !! :wink:
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56Trike

Posts: 123

Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 1:01 am

Location: Reno,NV USA

Post Thu Jun 29, 2006 7:08 am

Most informative topic on tranny tops I have read. Was the locating dowel in the front middle tranny top, in the 64/65 as well as the 66/73?
RJ
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Pa

Site Admin

Posts: 4478

Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2000 1:01 am

Location: Ohio USA

Post Thu Jun 29, 2006 7:48 am

1964-73 E Start Transmission Case. Pa

Image
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44u

Posts: 304

Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2004 12:01 am

Location: oklahoma usa

Post Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:50 pm

You might consider farming the lower end out to someone familiar with HDs.
The old Triumphs had shell rod bearings and caged ball bearings for mains so putting a lower end together was simple. The HD will be a bit more complicated than that and involves a number of expensive tools.
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Bikefiend Chuck

Posts: 2

Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2006 9:11 am

Post Mon Aug 07, 2006 1:11 pm

Thanks for all the info

I ain't skeered a bit.I should have this triumph engine buttoned up today and then the 45 motor going on my bench.Im gonna do all i can myself,theres a Harley shop about 4 miles from here and they pretty cool about just fixing what you don't have tools to do with yourself.Thats real interesting about those trans. covers.Thats the kinda stuff i was wondering about.I'll post again when i get this engine tore down...Thanks again....Chuck

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